Making Green: A Wage Slog Thread

Canvassing went fine!! I got to meet my candidate and they were super cool and easy to talk to. Only one person slammed their door in my face, most everyone else was either leaning NDP or in the middle of a video call.

A couple houses with old ladies living in them insisted we come in out of the snow to warm up, one of which had three older nurses living together that my canvassing partner and I both figured were probably a lesbian throuple. We weren’t technically supposed to enter anyone’s house because apparently a long time ago someone did that and got abducted! but if the candidate keeps doing it who’s gonna tell them to stop??

I’m sorry, it happened. :( This one lady’s late husband was American so of course we had to talk about the state of things.

I didn’t think it should enter into things much though because it’s provincial but the current premier Doug Ford—brother of the late Rob “more than enough to eat at home” Ford—has been doing all this posturing in response to Trump’s 51st state mishegoss, and talking about who’s best suited to negotiate. I’ve been like, buddy: you are not the PM. Trump doesn’t know you exist. He even made hats.

That’s been my take on the one hand but on the other, after cancelling Ontario’s Starlink contract, Musk actually tweeted about it. So, loser behaviour all around.

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how dare you

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I’ve been hearing my boss yell more lately and I feel like quitting about it.
I haven’t yet, but mostly because there are some certifications that I want that will get me more money at other jobs HOWEVER
I’ve also been thinking a lot about going back to school for a lot of reasons.
Initially I was thinking of going back for electronics engineering, which would be very helpful in my current field, but I’ve recently started taking a japanese course sponsored by a local university and I’ve really been enjoying it.
Making me think that I’d really like to major in japansese so I’m able to dedicate myself to that for a little bit.
Haven’t really put a lot of effort into learning a language since high school and I forgot how much I liked it.
Might be a little less practical though.
But enjoying my life also sounds kinda cool.

Also, I wake up upset and a little scared everyday for the past couple weeks or so and possibly moving to another country is a little easier with a degree lmao.

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One of my least favorite things is happening at work. We’re the professionals but were letting the client force through bad ideas because they think it’s better. Meanwhile we are telling them it’s actually not better. But what do we know. We just do this all the time and are being paid by you to tell you what we think.
Client knows best

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I love work but man do I hate having a fucking job…

I still have trouble not feeling like a total fuckup when this happens, but, I really do strongly feel that this keeps happening to me because I give too much of a shit, and don’t keep my mouth shut when things aren’t right, and I don’t hesitate to advocate for myself.

In particular with this job it always felt like they would expect us to perform our roles according to one policy, only to scold us for not following another one, even when these policies end up being contradictory, or just the kinds of situations we dealt with placed them in tension. For example, I got in shit for not stopping a student from leaving the site without properly discharging them, yet we have no authority to stop them and the service is explicitly supposed to be voluntary (and it made no difference that I had followed the student to the door and kept trying to convince them to not leave and they did not listen). Not to mention the service routinely did not really treat the students as if it was voluntary at all in a lot of situations, it often felt like to me the organization wanted the fuzzy good feelings of having nice wordings in the operational policies, but they didn’t want to have to do the harder work that would come from actually operating the service according to those principles.

For example I feel that a lot of language in the policies mention how the service was supposed to be non-judgemental, yet, there was a lot of incentive for people in my position to assume students were intoxicated without clear evidence as to that. The specific incident cited in my termination letter, I assessed a student using a simple medical tool, and saw no clear signs… yet according to my manager when that student went back up to the dorms they were “extremely intoxicated.” Never mind that I didn’t actually make the decision to send that student up, the worker from the dorms did, I’m kinda left wondering when they were allegedly extremely intoxicated, and how that was even determined… I merely performed the test as objectively as I could, and the test doesn’t actually measure intoxication so much as it measures impairment. So, theoretically, if a particular individual would be able to really competently walk, talk, draw a line between to curved lines, follow the tip of a pen with their eyes, and touch the tip of a pen with their fingertip while under strongly the influence of alcohol, the only tool I was given to assess intoxication and make discharge decisions would be entirely worthless.

I’ll never forget this but something my manager said while they were firing me was, paraphrasing here, that I acted “like I cared more about caring for the students than I did about following workplace policy,” which, like, guilty as charged, and boy was that ever an interesting Freudian slip.

Maybe worth mentioning that about 3 weeks ago I hand delivered an anonymized letter (I mean it was obvious it was me and my manager could have easily verified it by seeing who had put something in their mail cubby the day before they received it) detailing how a scheduling practice they were routinely engaging in was illegal. The day before I was fired I complained about it for myself because the practice hadn’t stopped for most people, and though they didn’t do so for the few weeks before that to me, they had scheduled me unlawfully with that same practice.

Maybe worth a chat with an employment lawyer, if for nothing else to see what kind of documentation they took to establish the cause to fire me.

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would be funny to put that on your resume

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This sounds like you were set up to fail from the beginning.

Is it a legal restriction that prevents services like you were providing from using devices like alcohol breath testers? Making you just perform “sobriety tests” like following the tip of a pen seems like an institutionalised way to ensure you (meaning the wider collective of people in your position, not that this is a personally vindictive policy against Exactly You) are always in a position to take the fall.

If you were to look for similar roles in similar institutions, do you have any idea if you would be similarly restricted?

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Agreed, and I was always talking about this, even with my manager. My coworkers and I were always talking about how we felt like we were constantly in damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don’t situations, and I feel like there were at least a handful of instances where I did the exact same thing with other students and there were no complaints. I can definitely remember at least one instance where I also mistakenly discharged a student up to the dorms who was apparently still intoxicated, no disciplinary follow up for that one, though.

Worth mentioning I suppose that the dorms, understandably, had a zero tolerance policy for possession of alcohol on premises or consumption of alcohol on or off premises, and I think a lot of the shit we ended up dealing with was because of that. However, they also I feel actively impeded students from using the harm reduction site because they would get reprimanded and even potentially evicted from the dorms for using the harm reduction site…! Which I think actively discouraged the residents of the dorm using the site and staying safe, and instead encouraged residents of the dorms to do the kind of thing where they’d try and sneak back into the dorms drunk or high, because we of course also reported them being there to the dorms. No one working with the students wanted them to be putting themselves into dangerous situations, like, say, they figure they could get in less trouble for missing curfew than for being caught drunk or high, but I feel that the expectation that they willingly submit to processes which could lead to their eviction was totally naïve. So I guess a lot of the issues we faced were because we were a harm reduction (adjacent) service that had a massive service overlap with a housing situation that was really not compatible with a harm reduction ethos.

It really often felt like the higher-ups did not really understand what we did, and why, and I also feel that they were very paranoid about poor service outcomes, such that they would give our manager shit, who would then give us shit, for not just poor service outcomes, but even if we were to have allowed the possibility of a poor service outcome. And, of course, they always saw these events through the clarity of hindsight.

To be fair the funding for the service came about as a response to an inquest about the suspicious and unresolved deaths of young people who came to the city to go to high school from remote communities. So, I get the paranoia. It’s more just that I resent how they, yes, as you said, set workers up to take the fall for being unable to respond adequately with incomplete information or limited resources. And I personally took umbrage with practices which I felt were judgmental, invasive, or did not show trust or respect towards the clientele.

Again this is probably due to the novelty of the service but frankly I would hope that other harm reduction sites don’t have to compel their workers to be narcs about what they do in nearly the same way. Much less legal complexity with regards to offering safety and food and warmth to intoxicated adults who don’t live in a shelter on the other side of a building where intoxication is completely prohibited. Ain’t nothin’ illegal about being drunk or high, as an adult, it’s only illegal to possess illicit substances in large enough quantities (or if after the fact you cause a public disturbance, I guess).

Then again I don’t even know for sure. There is a hysterical politically motivated hysterical backlash against harm reduction here right now so maybe the loopholes in question are actually tighter than I assumed they are, and so there is a motivation within harm reduction operation right now to buff out even perceived rough edges.

On one hand, I imagine that it’s complicated. It was a pretty novel gig, to remind everyone I was working in a harm reduction site which operated within what is basically a private high school. So, to some degree, we were operating within somewhat of a legal gray area (pretty off-white light gray if you were to ask me) in terms of harbouring people who were intoxicated on either illicit substances, or lawful substances with which they are not the legal age to obtain and consume. Like, if if any of our actions or procedures or services were technically against the law I would unashamedly say it was Good, Actually, but, I did always assume that the reason we weren’t using things like breathalyzers or blood tests was because of procedural limits that were the result of, I dunno, procedural compromises imposed on the site itself in order for it to qualify for Ministry funding, of which I was pretty sure it was majorly dependent on (I could be wrong but yeah I’m pretty sure it existed because of government subsidization).

Like, I know for instance in our jurisdiction it is lawful for someone below the legal age to consume alcohol, but only if it is supplied by a parent or guardian, and, only if it is consumed under supervision of that parent or guardian, and said alcohol can only be consumed in the same place it was supplied, which I believe must also be a private domicile. And as far as I can tell in the letter of the law being drunk in public while also not of legal age to consume alcohol is not lawful either, but, like, you know how these things are, the law is written like that mainly to retroactively justify law enforcement after one has caused some kind of public disturbance.

It’s also more of a best practice than a lawful requirement but workers in community services like that are encouraged to collect only what personal information as is necessary to perform their duties, and I would think that though the results from the simple motor skills test are ambiguous enough that, say, it couldn’t be retroactively be used after the fact to establish something like a public disturbance charge, I do wonder if the result from a breathalyzer test would be a lot closer to something that could retroactively determine criminal liability (or maybe not, as I understand it there are serious problems with the admissibility of the result of breathalyzer tests), so there would be reluctance to collect that information.

I could imagine a scenario where eligibility for a stay at the harm reduction site in question would demand the motor skills test, as it does now, but could potentially employ a breathalyzer test only with the consent of the client, with the option to not consent to it (though I would expect that the narc tendencies of my former jobsite would just indirectly urge people in my position to interpret a refusal to submit to a breathalyzer test as an indirect admission of the consumption of alcohol, so, that’s kinda opening up a whole other bag of kettles of cats, worms, and beans).

On the other fucking hand, like a week or two ago, I saw a bag sitting in the site’s office that had, lo and behold, several unopened breathlyzers in it. They weren’t buried inside of some storage closet as if to suggest they were at one time purchased by the site to be used but the administration could not justify their usage and hid them away, they were by the manager’s desk as if they had been recently purchased. So… I might have Cassandra’d my own damn self here lol. If they do soon allow breathalyzer results to be collected during intake, and for that to factor into any monitoring or discharge determinations, I am going to be so fucking pissed. I lost my job because I didn’t have a lie detector, basically, and I guess even with its problems, a breathalyzer is the closest thing to a lie detector (without using a medical lab anyway) when the sole question is “did you recently consume alcohol?”

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Definitely talk to a lawyer. Depending on what state you work in you might have a suit. There’s no way of telling if the student drank more between when you saw them and when he got back to the dorms. If you were fired before management assessed that fact, then you might have a wrongful termination case.

EDIT: I just remembered that you’re anishinaabe and might be in Canada. I don’t know anything about canadian law.

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No prob, cuz. I am indeed in Canada. But, in terms of this, it’s pretty much the same, here, legally speaking.

I was talking to my bestie last night and yeah, this more or less occurred to me, too.

It’s unlikely the student consumed alcohol between going from the site to the dorms, since, well, same building, and they return to the dorms with an escort.

However, as far as I know, it’s highly unlikely they obtained hard evidence that the student was factually intoxicated. As far as I know, the dorms don’t even perform the motor skills assessment. They certainly don’t perform breathalyzer tests to my knowledge, or take blood samples for establishing a blood alcohol content.

What I guess I don’t understand there is that I didn’t even make the decision to bring the student back up to the dorms, and, I even told the worker who chose to take the student back up that if the student was intoxicated after all and my assessment was inaccurate, they should be returned to the site to be monitored.

It is possible they slammed a bunch back immediately before being brought to the site, and we did have a best practice to monitor students who we suspected to be intoxicated for a minimum of 1 hour, which theoretically should be long enough for a stunt like that to start to show the expected results.

I think it’s also possible that they could have somehow found a way to smuggle alcohol into their dorm room ¯_(ツ)_/¯ if they were “extremely intoxicated” a certain length of time after being discharged from our care, there’s almost no other explanation.

In any case it wasn’t really clearly explained to me what the actual problem with that specific student was and why my acquiescence to the dorm worker wanting them discharged. I even remember being a bit surprised they decided to take him up to the dorms. Seems flippant to claim this even by my standards, but, like, it’s not exactly impossible that this student spilled rubbing alcohol on their clothes (allegedly the driver smelled alcohol, but, I did not) and then chose to act like a drunken asshole in the dorms.

In any case I think the only way they have a solid evidentiary basis for saying I inadequately assessed the student for intoxication is if they were so intoxicated that they had to be brought to the hospital, and were administered a toxicology test. But even then I don’t see how I could be held responsible for that since if the student was that intoxicated, we would also be bringing them to the hospital…


I had a quick consultation through a pro bono legal advice hotline and the lawyer seemed to think that what I described didn’t meet the high threshold for terminating an employee with cause.

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Good because getting fired over nothing is so GD demoralizing. One of the worst experiences.

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