Ep. 199 - Dreamcast Fruit, with Chris Kohler

@“Syzygy”#p41485 that‘s interesting, I was writing all that without much research and from my limited perspective of my experience in the early 2010’s so I know there are a lot of things i‘m missing. I’m gonna check it out!

at last caught up on the podcast and can comment once again

I stopped listening at 1:02:56 in order to see if I can guess some more of these Wikipedia games the guys are struggling with. My hypothesis here is they simply haven't watched enough of the Angry Video Game Nerd or read listicles published in 2010 about the worst games "of all time."

going by my blender junk of memories about those lists etc, these are the games which haven't been guessed yet but which I'm thinking might appear on that there list

  • - Superman 64
  • - Zelda Wand of Gamelon and Faces of Evil
  • - Mario is Missing or Mario Teaches Typing or Mario's Time Machine
  • - Custer's Revenge
  • - Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde
  • - Snake's Revenge
  • - Top Gun (NES)
  • - Super 3D Noah's Ark (or Bible Adventures)
  • - Ghostbusters (NES)
  • - Alien vs Predator (Jaguar)
  • I haven't read any of the comments or even finished the episode so apologies if this is redundant or foolish. I will now finish the episode and check the list

    after listening to the end of the episode I feel abject disappointment in my poor recall of Wikipedia-bland game trivia

    @“captain”#p41528 whoa, no way avp would be on there! Who was hating on that game? I think it's still widely regarded as one of the better jaguar games.

    @“exodus”#p41531 there were a few games I was considering, AVP among them, that were like “people in general actually do like this one but the AVGN or similar early Youtube game person hated on it and made it a meme to hate on it,” as with e.g. Simon‘s Quest or Final Fantasy VIII, and I gambled on the idea that whoever was conspiring to write that Wikipedia list was just drawing from that early ’10s Youtube milieu. Anyway I just checked and the Nerd had nothing bad to say about AVP-Jag (or FFVIII, that was a different guy).

    What was I thinking?


    Yeah, as someone who actually enjoys a fair bit of gaming YouTube (not the super-YouTubey stuff) as like, light calories when I have 20 minutes & want to engage with some easy media, that Wikipedia list really should be called “Video Games Notable Because Popular Video Game YouTubers Dunked On Them”

    Other thoughts:

  • -

    My one friend who had a Jaguar at the time & I thought Alien vs. Predator was pretty great

  • -

    I recently gifted a loose copy of The World Ends With You & within 24 hours it evaporated into the ether of an apartment (DS games are small). For now, it's lost to the void, but I bet the giftee will find a nice copy of The World Ends With You whenever she moves

  • -

    I have been playing Boyfriend Dungeon & I honestly think the developers did a pretty great job, in terms of the warning, the incorporation of the themes themselves (which do have value in the game, & could/should not be toggled off), interesting & easygoing accessibility features, & their reception of the discourse around it. My hope is that the discourse is more reparative (making good features better) than it is unintentionally destructive (warding people off from the game, from expressing difficult themes, or from including content warnings at the risk of not doing them to the internet's collective standards). I don't foresee a perfect solution, but one idea I like for developers who do choose to include content warnings is a two-screen pop up: One screen that basically says: 'A vague heads up, this game deals with this type of issue. Would you like to know more?' Then if you choose 'yes,' a more specific description of the severity/placement of that content so that you can hopefully make a more informed decision

  • @“穴”#p41477


    I just want both of you to know that I appreciate a post referencing TTT was replied to one that included SS13.

    I played a lot of TTT and I watched a lot of SS13, both are completely bonkers (especially SS13) and indecipherable.

    Glad to hear guest panelist Chris Kohler said FFV is the best.

    On a side note about RPG opinions, I get annoyed when people say "turn-based RPG" as if it was a bad thing.

    I am intrigued by the “would you like to know more” idea! One could say “there may be mild spoilers if you proceed” and I think you're then in the clear. Hmm!


    @“tokucowboy”#p41541 Would you like to know more?

    I apologise, but seeing that phrase will _always_ conjure up Starship Troopers mental images for me... which would both be an amazing and highly insensitive way of presenting these warnings.

    I suspect the dialog about content in games is simply less mature than the dialog about content in other art forms such as novels or movies or music. Because games (and movies and novels and music) as packaged and marketed are mostly commercial art, I think the general population of non-Insert Credit forum participants doesn‘t see a game and perceive it as art at all, but as a product. Some products have content warnings (movie ratings, explicit lyrics warnings on albums) whereas others (novels) generally don’t at all.

    I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm saying that as a culture, we haven't gotten to the point where a game has an assumption of value as art that a movie does. I think that is one of the reasons why there is a certain category of parent that wouldn't let little Jimmy and Sally see an R-rated movie, but still isn't sophisticated enough to pass on Call of Duty for their 11 year old. The same category of person would often agree that books shouldn't be banned, but maybe wouldn't let Jimmy and Sally read the latest sexy New York Times best seller.

    We all love to argue and debate games on Insert Credit. The primary reason we're all here is that we understand that games have inherent value as a creative work (even if its exploitative in some aspect). So I think that we all have a certain level of sophistication as games consumers that others may not. Much like I will never be as sophisticated a consumer of Comics as say Alex is.

    If there's a content bait-and-switch situation, that's one thing. If games developers and directors are being provocateurs that's another. Ultimately, not all art is made for you as an individual. That insight takes a certain amount of maturity to realize and we as a culture of games-touchers are probably not there yet.

    yes I get the sense that once again videogame/ tech people are reinventing the dang wheel. Not that it’s bad to look at these issues with fresh eyes, it’s just that there are centuries worth of insight/nuance/potential solutions that are just never brought into the discussion

    Edit: I don’t know much about “fandoms” but it seems like there’s this expectation of having your personal emotional needs satisfied by a consumer product that is alien to the kind of audience expectation of other media, where you’re just interested to experience a creative work for its own sake

    would it be worth the increased risk of a breakthrough infection to go to wrestlemania with a big pathologic 2 related sign?


    @“yeso”#p41593 would it be worth the increased risk of a breakthrough infection to go to wrestlemania with a big pathologic 2 related sign?

    If you're vaccinated and if you're wearing a mask, it's very likely within your risk tolerance. But I personally want to see you waving a sign about how [OP Citan is once he gets his sword](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6rVNxBjRC4&t=534s). Something like "Citan is the true hero of Solaris!"


    @“yeso”#p41592 I don’t know much about “fandoms” but it seems like there’s this expectation of having your personal emotional needs satisfied by a consumer product that is alien to the kind of audience expectation of other media, where you’re just interested to experience a creative work for its own sake

    Oh, yeah, I feel there's a lot of entitlement in entertainment discourse. Look at the endgame of the _Mass Effect 3_ nonsense.

    I'm a white male that likes hip-hop. I understand that not all of it (if any!) is "made for me". That's OK! I can deal with it by either enjoying what I enjoy, or possibly being challenged by the content!

    @“thebryanjzx90”#p41453 hey don't yeah to them like that! Honest mistake!


    @“穴”#p41477 That’s for babies,

    I'll play games for babies until the day I die thank you very much


    My immediate, listening in the car. answer was just Majora's Mask. However, I've been playing Deadly Premonition for the first time (I don't care for it if I'm being honest, and I don't know what's wrong with me). The sidequests where the lady is running around with a potentially empty pot and asks you for a ride home, during which she berates you for driving too slowly and safely are great.

    Excepting the fact that this is just a joke poking fun at mental illness that we need to stop doing and encouraging.

    I think we need a dental surgeon/dentist simulator. The right people could make that game hilarious.

    @“SneakingMission”#p41447 Also pretty sure your screenname disqualifies you from weighing in on side mission enjoyment…

    Frank's (I believe it was him) dismissal of website databases for certain triggers in media is, I think, somewhat baseless. Obviously having a tumblr link on a game box is not a blanket solution for including more robust content warnings, but people who struggle with the lack of content warnings have been using sites such as these for years. I remember stumbling across one on Tumblr that had a number of different categories for triggers. I also had a girlfriend a couple of years back who had a really strong fear of seeing or hearing people throwing up who used a similar site.

    The framework of using this collective knowledge is already pretty strong. A proper next step could be to create an aggregated source to allow a one stop shop for any disturbing content you want to avoid. Obviously this requires a substantial amount of effort, but people ARE already making these accommodations outside of official channels (there are even websites for parents who are particular about what their children watch with much more detailed warnings than the MPAA). We already have Metacritic, which is _every_ game kid's _favorite_ website and has started to bleed onto online stores, and even retail boxes (without mentioning the practice of basing bonuses on scores). I think that the pieces are there if we can just connect them somehow.

    @“dylanfills”#p41602 ah, that was just a joke about the “Good Job, Brain!” trivia thing that Kohler is involved with