This Odyssey isn't going to Etrian itself

video games
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@“yeso”#385 what are you quoting?

There have been re-releases and games in the series with no FM music, but most of them have it available as DLC, and it is some of the most worthwhile DLC I have ever seen.

@"gsk"#70 do you mean the music in the HD rerelease? On DS it sounded more compressed, but not at all in a bad way. Also the small speakers cause it to be more tinny.

I've been playing the switch version quite a bit the past couple days and it sounds great through my big speakers and the switch console speakers alike. I could plug in my DS to do a sound comparison...

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@“treefroggy”#p118311 Yeah I mean the HD versions' remastered music, but EO3HD in particular does have some new music—Koshiro wrote new boss music for the later stratums, rather than have the game recycle the same one over and over as it originally did.

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@“treefroggy”#p118311 what are you quoting?

the pcgamer review of the new collection. It’s not clear to me base on the wording if FM synth is an option, as it was with the 3ds games

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Omg I defeated Fenrir for the first time

And I forgot to use Boost lol

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Can someone please explain how auto-walk routes work in this version?

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About 7 hours into the HD version of the first game on Switch. I enjoy dungeon crawlers but often disagree with their masochistic tendencies, have been interested in Etrian Odyssey since the beginning with a couple false starts, and currently own a bootleg of the first DS game and a digital copy of Millennium Girl on 3DS. So there's my context.

I'd say if you like That Sort of Thing, this HD release seems pretty good. I can't find my nice capacitive stylus to try the touch controls (I refuse to grub up my Switch or use one of those fat rubber styli that come in a 20-pack only), but the button controls for mapping are really fascinating. We're to the point where it's not really often that you see a lateral application of a dual-analog controller, but this is that; your movement is relegated to the dpad, while the sticks are in charge of map controls and "drawing," with some really unconventional button assignments for the latter that absolutely can't be called intuitive, but that do actually work, in that they give you everything you'd want to make DS-style maps on a post-Xbox control pad. It's definitely one of those control schemes that makes your brain (my brain) buffer a bit before doing something (but so is the control scheme for that new Zelder and people seem to like that), but it manages to wholly capture the emotional satisfaction of filling in your map, if not the tactile satisfaction of it. Not sure if the PC versions let you put the map on a second monitor, but if they do and you like playing on PC, that would probably be extremely chill. In the meantime, I'm impressed by how uncompromising the gamepad controls are, even if you can't change the heart of a made-for-DS game like this.

I'm into the remastered art, which can be a hit or miss thing. The character portraits and dungeons themselves fare better than enemies for me, though, which I can't quite put my finger on (maybe because the enemy portraits are more interactable, and a high-quality JPEG can't maintain that illusion?). Unexpectedly, the changeable in-game difficulty settings might make this one of the more accessible dungeon crawlers out there; "Basic" setting has been my goldilocks, but "Picnic" setting (which does something like 5x damage output, huge XP scaling and a massive reduction to damage taken) seems like it'll ensure that if you just want to see the dang game through, you'll be able to do that -- and that's an option I always appreciate, even just to take comfort knowing it's there. Also neat that it potentially recontextualizes the games as extremely relaxed "just let me draw maps with no worries in the world" type of experiences, if you want that.

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IMO, All turn based RPGs, but especially first person dungeon crawlers, are about as much about using your imagination as a table top session. To me, the sprites and battle animations are just a slightly more embellished equivalent to painted miniatures. With EO, the original DS artwork was nice and pixel-y, but it also had a homemade, Deviantart/Pixiv, “what is anatomy?” janky quality to it that I feel puts even more emphasis on imagination. I‘m usually really picky and almost always prefer to play the original version of any given game… To an extreme degree. EO HD is a rare occurrence where playing the Switch version makes sense to me, and I’m really enjoying it, ten hours in, I've made more progress than I ever have before.

The upscaled art hasn't bothered me one bit. There may be some noticeable curves here and there, but in the heat of battle I've barely thought about it.

I'm mostly glad they ported the original versions, and not the "Untold" version. If they had to choose one over the other, and not a combination, that's what I would prefer, especially since it still includes lots of the QoL changes. BUT, with the ultimate supremacy that is the Final Fantasy XII Zodiac Age Switch port, they could have gone above and beyond like that one did and include multiple versions of the soundtrack... It would be cool to have the NDS version, but also a toggleable *Untold* acoustic instrumentation would be really fun-- that's something I've already experienced in EOV, having the FM DLC. It's always nice to switch between versions...

I've gotten really fast with the map controls with sticks, it took me a couple floors before I got it. Now I use the sticks even in portable mode, because my fingers on the touch screen don't seem nearly as precise as a stylus on DS. I will also look into finding a stylus too. @"tokucowboy"#653 let me know if you find one...

The novelty of seeing this game in widescreen on a portable hasn't worn off yet either. This is the perfect game to have on Switch. If battery was ever and issue for me (it's not), this game could even be a good candidate for *underclocking* the console to save battery, I presume.

This comes at a time where I was getting really sick of looking at my Switch backlog of all child-friendly games.

The DS and 3DS versions will always be there-- and with **three of them** to play on original DS alone, the pick up and play quality, and familiarity you get from playing the switch version ad nauseam, I could see myself picking II or III up once I complete my NDS AV Output mod and playing on CRT too!

More on the music:
Listening to the DS version of the second stratum theme, both are good... But the clarity in this HD version is appreciated. The second stratum theme *goes tf IN* with some really juicy FM sounds that are sometimes overlooked like those creepy little strings. The main difference, using the Primitive Jungle theme as the example here, is that on DS the bass waveform was a bit more bitcrunchy, and in HD it's a smooth smooth FM electric bass. I could see the crunched version being preferred, but practically all the other waveforms are improved by a higher sample rate IMO. There's a lot of little flourishes and less-used instruments (like the creepy plucked strings in this example) that I would barely notice playing on the NDS, even with headphones on.

Back on the subject of Switch controllers:

  • - for portable mode, the Hori d-pad joycon gets the job done. Anyone with the bigger Hori joycon replacements would have a great time too.
  • - Docked, I've tried using the Switch Pro Controller, 8bitdo SN30 Pro, the 8bitdo Pro 2, and the *NSO Super Famicom Controller*. All of them are a joy to use. The lack of any rumble whatsoever has the Switch Pro controller's features going unused, but the face buttons, triggers, etc still feel great. SN30 Pro is a fair choice that has everything and gives the retro feel without sacrificing joysticks for mapping, but when I switched to the 8bitdo Pro 2 I was reminded why I love it-- the ergonomics are comfy, and the rapid fire A button makes doing repetitive tasks like mining a breeze. The NSO Super Famicom Controller is unable to access the map drawing controls, but I used it when I had all 5 floors of the first stratum fully mapped, and I was making many many trips to do various things like fighting the boss. I was using the SFC controller when I finally beat the boss. It feels great if you're obsessed with the feeling of playing old RPGs.

    • Come to think of it, I haven't used my Retro Bit Saturn pad for this game yet, but it resembles a Saturn game as much as it would a Super Famicom game... I'll use that next too..

    You can see from all this that I'm really into the game... here I am going off about controllers again...

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    @“tokucowboy”#653 I watched annoying youtube videos so you don't have to…

    This is apparently the best / closest we can get to an affordable fine-tip stylus on the Nintendo Switch: disc tips.

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    @“treefroggy”#p118723 maaaaaaaan, I just do not know about those little discs (but I‘m neurotic about touchscreens, I really miss styli and hate that we decided to embrace screens-everywhere, full touch-based interfaces that immediately look like garbo the instant a human touches them – I yearn for the metal telescopic stylus of the OG 3DS). Somewhere in this apartment, I have one of those USB-chargeable fine-tipped capacitive styluses that I bought when I used to have a hybrid touchscreen laptop. Those are a little more expensive, but it looks like you can get em on sale for about $12. One review for this one says it doesn’t work for Switch, but I don‘t know why it wouldn’t? I'll report back if I rustle mine up in the next few days

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    @“tokucowboy”#p118730 I have a glass screen protector on my switch, so the disc should be fine, if a bit weird.

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    Huge tip for any newcomers:

    The toughest lesson to learn in any of these games is you can play yourself into a corner with skill allocation. It‘s best to commit to getting something up a few levels before you diversify or spread yourself too thin. For the first two stratum, you want your characters to almost exclusively work on improving their main job: casters should focus on one element (usually fire), and healers on the basic cure spell and the general healing skill. But also you want to avoid beefing up the specific spell and causing it to cost too much TP. by floor two you’ll be improving their TP. It‘s all about committing to making one thing effective. It’s a lot like dark souls in that way, where you really need to min-max to get over the hurdles and front-loaded difficulty. You can respec, but it sends your character back a couple levels.

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    I‘ve picked up all three releases on Steam (Fanatical are selling individual games and the collection for an extra 12% off) and I’m going to be starting with EO2. I‘ve got every EO game except remakes on DS and 3DS but I don’t think my eyes could handle playing the original DS games on a small screen anymore and I would surely have a chill time with them on my TV.

    I've only played EO1, 4, 5, and a little bit of Nexus but despite not playing 2 or 3 I've really wanted to get around to them one day, and I'm desperately trying to get my friends to play EO now.

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    I’ve got two hours by bus today, thank the lort that I have EO

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    I‘ve been doing my normal thing with EO games, which is to start a game (in this case EO3) and then do a bunch of false starts where I try to home in on what my party needs to be shaped like. Usually it emerges sometime during the first little dungeon excursion so I never feel like I’m repeating that much, and it looks as though that‘s how it will go here too. And I should be clear, I’m not doing some kind of wild min-maxing or something, I'm just trying things out to see what party composition feels right, in a completely unscientific way (this is something I love about the series).

    I hadn't quite realized that one of my least favourite classes from EO Nexus came from this game: the Zodiac, so I'm seeing about Zodiac-less party choices and if they're viable, but it stinks because as far as I can tell they're one of the only elemental magic dealers, so I may just have to suck it up and live with one. I also wish it wasn't making me choose between a Wildling and a Ninja for status effect infliction! I guess I could do both since I so often rely on status effects in EO games.

    I probably sound extremely blasé about all this but I'm having quite a bit of fun and I'm super glad I started with this one!

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    Speaking of min-maxing. Do people have a separate gathering party usually? I feel like it‘s the best option for optimising skill points but dang, I’ve never felt like I can be arsed to level a second party just for item gathering.

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    @“LeFish”#p119092 I hadn‘t normally for 1/2/4/5, but in 3 and Nexus, the farmer class is such a beast for gathering that my understanding is most folks do create a second party of mostly farmers, so I was thinking of doing it in this playthrough. But farmers are so ridiculously underpowered otherwise that I thought I’d give them at least a damage dealer and a defender to keep them from being instantly killed.

    But personally I've always run two or more parties for all kinds of situations. Grinding is kinda what the game is about, and I mostly enjoy it. Also I'm not personally in a rush since I enjoy taking my time and really learning the ins and outs of things.

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    I‘m a huge fan of the EO games. Played every single one, though I haven’t finished many.

    Haven't really seen anyone in this thread talk about the enemy art in the remasters. In my opinion, it looked pretty rough in the trailers. Just static images that look kind of weird now that they're no longer pixel art.

    Does it rub anyone else the wrong way? Do you sort of get used to it after a while?

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    @“Karasu”#p119079 I probably sound extremely blasé about all this but I’m having quite a bit of fun and I’m super glad I started with this one!

    heck no, you just described my exact experiences with EO in the past dude. ight down to classes not always feeling suited to your interests. **False starts are what all the best RPGs are about**, and the more old-school they are with character rolling, the more true that is. EO and Dark Souls are like this, and it's not the only thing they have in common, haha.

    Like I said above, once you get your skills rolling and stuff and get over the first major hurdle boss, you may have enough momentum to get you quite far through the game!

    @"LeFish"#p119092 This time around, I used one skill point for each character towards one of the three gathering skills. I never make alts for that, but you could if you wanted.

    Right now in EO 1, after getting far in the third stratum, I went back to do a quest that requires you stay for *5 days straight* in on a floor in the 2nd stratum. AKA grind for a long time. So I am using this opportunity to kick start a Ronin to level 20 and kill two birds with one stone, finishing the lvl 20 ronin quest.

    >

    @“whatsarobot”#p119208 Haven’t really seen anyone in this thread talk about the enemy art in the remasters.

    I have! I said above that it doesn't bother me one bit. These games, and the type of RPGs I like, are about using your imagination. The original artwork, especially in the first game, had an amateurish, deviantart-like jank to it, that makes it really easy for me to overlook any imperfections here, because it's about using your imagination anyways. But on top of that, it just hasn't bothered me at all. Though eventually I will return to the DS version, and check it out with composite blending on CRT with the NDS AV output mod. But yeah, as someone who doesn't play remasters or rereleases as a rule, this one gets five stars from me. Or 4.9 stars, if FFXII Zodiac Age for Nintendo Switch is the 5 gold star standard.

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    Look, I know it ain’t much you guys

    But in this world of disappointments and “piss poor ports”, it’s a miracle this game looks, sounds and plays as well as it does, let alone being made at all! It’s not exactly the most popular franchise! It’s kind of niche by design!

    I don’t think Digital Foundry will be picking it apart, but if I had to guess, mines running a smooth 60fps on standard docked clock speeds, and that may be one of the reasons I’m so enamored by this version!

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    @“treefroggy”#p119227 Well shoot. Sorry I missed you talking about it. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. You raise a lot of good points about this series, and how it‘s probably perceived by non-fans, whose points of view I haven’t really considered. I‘ve always considered this to be a “BIG” series, because that’s what it‘s been in my life. But that’s a pretty niche point of view!

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